July 3, 2022: Big Gender 22

[longtimelurker]

https://sinfest.xyz/view.php?date=2022-07-03

OK I was going to post something like this after June 19, 2022: Big Gender 8 but I decided to bite my tongue as I know the main arc of this particular story (as I am reading into it at least) is around the topic of changing one's birth-assigned gender being portrayed as some sort of mental conditioning leading to a cosmetic-surgery-esque decision pushed by Big Gender for the sake of them making some bucks. That debate aside, I want to discuss something seemingly apparent in this Sunday's strip whereby it seems to suggest we can determine what gender you are by looking (or, in the case of panel 4 which is full of all kinds of ick, leering) at the individual, and by their biological functions. This is true in 99% of everyone on the planet, but like so much in our unique biodiverse little sphere, there are always exceptions.

Going back to Big Gender 8, specifically panels 7 and 8, I have to say that absolute is not true: I know of people with Complete Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome, that is to say that despite being a 46 XY chromosome (therefore should be typically male) their androgen insensitivity meant that after the first 6 weeks in the uterus their gonads (as in the medical term) developed into testes but failed to masculinize properly and thus, as they do not then produce (or fail to respond to) the androgens the body then develops as female, with the testes remaining in the place where the ovaries without the presence of a cervix or uterus. For those not keeping up with the biology lesson, let's just say they were born, identified as, and brought up as a female, went to school and indeed developed through puberty as female, and being phenotypically female, garnered the attraction as though they were a female. So why don't we just say they are female and be done with it? Because they aren't - they are sterile because they cannot produce eggs, they don't have periods because they don't have a uterus, their sex life is affected because of a shallowing of the vaginal canal, all because nature took a dump on their script. Most people with AIS/CAIS aren't diagnosed until puberty when things that should happen don't, or the genital ambiguity becomes more apparent. Their sexuality is not necessarily affected but in the case of someone I know their bisexuality is something they feel is as a result of their condition, and that's for them to decide, not me.

Knowing this person gave me the impetus to look into things with a bit more depth and to be sure there are enough people out there with complex genital dysmorphia and that are intersex that we shouldn't muddy the water for them by painting all this as a big joke about men wanting to dress up as women as some woke agenda thing.

To simply say that Men have a penis and Women have a vagina is a fair establishment if we are talking rules of thumb, but as we dont have the ambiguous genitalia identifying Quigley and Prader scales for nothing, life isn't always that cut and dry.

[RikkiTikkiTavi]

Life is not cut and dried - that a rare exception exists does not invalidate the normal.

That there are people out there with Androgen Insensitivity is true. Biologically they are male but they present with ambiguous or with female seeming genitalia. They are a very rare exception:

Is androgen insensitivity syndrome rare?
Complete Androgen insensitivity syndrome is a rare disorder affecting 2–5 per 100,000 genetically male individuals while partial AIS affects 5–7 per 1,000,000 genetically male individuals [1].

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7322742/

Knowing this person gave me the impetus to look into things with a bit more depth and to be sure there are enough people out there with complex genital dysmorphia and that are intersex that we shouldn't muddy the water for them by painting all this as a big joke about men wanting to dress up as women as some woke agenda thing.

To simply say that Men have a penis and Women have a vagina is a fair establishment if we are talking rules of thumb, but as we dont have the ambiguous genitalia identifying Quigley and Prader scales for nothing, life isn't always that cut and dry.

I would say although you know 'of' them, you probably do not know anyone with this condition. You are speculating that they would take offense to the normal way of thinking. I would counter that it is unlikely that anyone with this condition is asking us to forgo thinking that 'men have a penis and women have a vagina'.

They are not as a group demanding children to be allowed to go on puberty blockers. They are not as a group advocating for people under the age of 18 to have SRS. They are not at all the same situation as a grown adult 'identifying' as a woman and gaining access to women's spaces such as crisis centers and prisons - all while still swinging a functional penis.

They exist as a completely unique situation and they are not 'trans'. These are two completely different topics.

Tat is making a comic strip that to me illustrates current events. He does this in a humorous way sometimes and in a thought provoking way other times. Sometimes he throws in some things that are very sad.

It is a comic strip. God uses a hand puppet. I am not expecting things to be 'technically correct'.

[longtimelurker]

I would say although you know 'of' them, you probably do not know anyone with this condition. You are speculating that they would take offense to the normal way of thinking. I would counter that it is unlikely that anyone with this condition is asking us to forgo thinking that 'men have a penis and women have a vagina'.

I went to a school where one such individual was present. While we weren't best buds or anything we did interact. Some things were mentioned in sex ed that I just thought was normal coverage of topics I thought were a bit obscure at the time, but it wasn't until a reunion where we got talking that she admitted that such things were covered because of her condition, I put 2 and 2 together she was actually pretty open to questions I had seeing as I was being polite about things and all. The only other person I know with this condition I only know remotely because I follow them in a certain media (I'm not saying what or where for the sake of their privacy) but suffice to say they came out about it and I was actually thinking wow that's 2 in one lifetime so yeah... strange things can happen nonetheless. To answer your point raised 2-5 per 100k is still a few tens of thousands when applied to a populace of 300+ million like America alone, but the thing is such individuals usually remain private about their condition so you could interact with them and be none the wiser about it if they were. Moreover that is just that specific condition, as I said there are other intersex conditions with milder forms of ambiguity that occur as well, though I am less well versed on those. For the record, I never wished to infer that we should invalidate the norm because of exceptions, but also we shouldn't fall into the "they're statistically insignificant so we shouldn't care about it" point of view neither, which is the point I was trying to make, so apologies if that was unclear.

They are not as a group demanding children to be allowed to go on puberty blockers. They are not as a group advocating for people under the age of 18 to have SRS. They are not at all the same situation as a grown adult 'identifying' as a woman and gaining access to women's spaces such as crisis centers and prisons - all while still swinging a functional penis.

They exist as a completely unique situation and they are not 'trans'. These are two completely different topics.

I had hoped with the first paragraph of my opening post acknowledged that these are two different topics, and I know that some people around me have confused intersex with trans, or assumed that one led to the other through 'corrective measures' so I was bringing this whole thing up for that reason. Finally, to address the points you mentioned about groups advocating, there will always be people on the extremes of anything, gaming the system, taking advantage... To pick any other vaguely recently topical hot-potato: Women's healthcare rights around Abortions? So people using it as a form of contraception because they are *air quotes* "Irresponsible" have been used as scapegoats to screw over people who need legitimate access to such healthcare because someone once wrote in a book that their particular imaginary friend on a cloud told them it was a bad thing and every life should be carried to term because they say so. No I am not saying either group is right or wrong, nor that any solution society arrives at will be cookie-cutter perfect. Just that as a society we need to arrive at a compromise and not keep coming back to the same arguments just because we didn't like the results first time around, unless some fresh new evidence or situation warrants such redress. America seems to be fond of amendments after all they've done so 30+ times already.

[JustaComment]

Life is not cut and dried - that a rare exception exists does not invalidate the normal.

That there are people out there with Androgen Insensitivity is true. Biologically they are male but they present with ambiguous or with female seeming genitalia. They are a very rare exception:

Is androgen insensitivity syndrome rare?
Complete Androgen insensitivity syndrome is a rare disorder affecting 2–5 per 100,000 genetically male individuals while partial AIS affects 5–7 per 1,000,000 genetically male individuals [1].

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7322742/

Knowing this person gave me the impetus to look into things with a bit more depth and to be sure there are enough people out there with complex genital dysmorphia and that are intersex that we shouldn't muddy the water for them by painting all this as a big joke about men wanting to dress up as women as some woke agenda thing.

To simply say that Men have a penis and Women have a vagina is a fair establishment if we are talking rules of thumb, but as we dont have the ambiguous genitalia identifying Quigley and Prader scales for nothing, life isn't always that cut and dry.

I would say although you know 'of' them, you probably do not know anyone with this condition. You are speculating that they would take offense to the normal way of thinking. I would counter that it is unlikely that anyone with this condition is asking us to forgo thinking that 'men have a penis and women have a vagina'.

They are not as a group demanding children to be allowed to go on puberty blockers. They are not as a group advocating for people under the age of 18 to have SRS. They are not at all the same situation as a grown adult 'identifying' as a woman and gaining access to women's spaces such as crisis centers and prisons - all while still swinging a functional penis.

They exist as a completely unique situation and they are not 'trans'. These are two completely different topics.

Tat is making a comic strip that to me illustrates current events. He does this in a humorous way sometimes and in a thought provoking way other times. Sometimes he throws in some things that are very sad.

It is a comic strip. God uses a hand puppet. I am not expecting things to be 'technically correct'.

Where is the 'like' button? You are right. Thank you!